March 23, 2006

How do you salute?

Matty O'BlackFive and Sgt. Hook (and others) weigh in on this proposal from Maj. Gen. Vernon Lewis (ret.):

I gathered some 16 of my old military friends who agreed to sponsor a movement for Veterans to salute rather than place their hands over their heart when honoring the flag, fallen comrades, and/or the country. I have some from each of the four principal services. Three of them were former Vice Chiefs or Assistant Commandants of their services, and several were former CINC’s.

We refer to saluting when we do the pledge to the flag, when the National Colors pass or are presented, when the National Anthem or honors are played, or when taps are played and firing squads or guns render honors.

At first glance, it seems ludicrous, but the discussion has gotten pretty interesting. I myself am not sure where I stand. Traditionally, the salute is reserved for uniformed soldiers, but as a mark of respect from the duty-bound, a salute seems appropriate from a veteran who has taken an oath for life.

And I admit, I would love to see this:

Just imagine thousands of fans salutiing at NFL, MBA, and Major League Baseball games when the National Anthem is plalyed. It will telegraph a message to all others of how many have served this country in the Armed Forces—it will be a positive and patroitic message.

Wouldn't you?

Posted by caltechgirl at March 23, 2006 01:08 PM | TrackBack
Comments

I like the idea. I've been to many ballgames where the fans stand, but continue to eat, drink, and talk during the National Anthem. If the etiquette changes to require the salute from all vets, then I forsee much more respect for the flag and anthem. That would be a very cool sight to behold.

Posted by: jen at March 23, 2006 01:41 PM

I catch myself saluting sometimes..old habits are hard to break

Posted by: GUYK at March 23, 2006 02:39 PM

I disagree with much of this. It may sound like an academic point, but veterans are civilians, and this would appear to symbolically blur the line between the spheres of civil and military authority, which is highly inappropriate. The only unarmed, uncovered person in civilian dress who ever gives a military salute is the President--as Commander-in-Chief--and then only when returning a salute from uniformed personnel. Veterans should salute in accordance with the rules of the service from which they're retired, which means either a uniform or a uniform and cover is required before rendering a military salute, and then only when under arms.

I also must say that I find the comment in there from USMC Steve, "[w]e are different than the civilian pukes, and we are better" to be fundamentally anathema to the founding principles of this country. The Framers of the US Constitution were deeply distrustful of standing militaries, and of military authority. This is an attitude of long standing in the English-speaking world, and its legacy is the absolute subordination of military to civil authority. This level of contempt for "civilian pukes" makes one an heir not to those who wrote the constitution they swore to uphold, but to Oliver Cromwell, whose military dictatorship was one of the many historical lessons that constitution was drafted to avoid.

Posted by: Dave J at March 23, 2006 09:07 PM

Hey, why don't we just go back to the original salute. You know, the one that Hiltler adopted for the Nazis.

The origins of the pledge of allegiance will shock you as well!!

Don't believe me, look here! http://rexcurry.net/

Posted by: rex at March 25, 2006 09:22 AM

I would personally *love* to see that...

Posted by: Richmond at March 25, 2006 11:08 AM

I have a problem with some of this, first of all, I am a civilian. But I have got to tell you guys and gals, that I am probably one of the most patriotic civilians out there. It brings me to tears when I hear of a fellow American dying in Iraq or Afghanistan. I am constantly donating, watching everything I can about service in the middle east, talking with friends who are serving, sending packages, etc. etc. But when Im at home watching a ball game, or when Im watching a documentary about Iraq, and a flag appears, blowing in the sandy wind, I cant help but to salute. I think to myself, there are so many men who have given their life for me, and the men around them, that it is the least I can do. I dont know if it is nescessarily ceremonialy correct, but I tell you what, it is the only thing that feels suffice in that moment. When tears are running down my face, and feelings of such overwhelming grattitude and respect come over me, it is almost as if saluting comes naturally. However, I am a civilian, and I do question it. But I feel like to me its such a more significant show of my solidarity with our men and women of the armed forces. I know that in "general" a salute is a show of solidarity and respect to a fellow service man or a person of higher rank,however it means so much more than that as well.Tell me what yall think. God Bless all of our service men who have been KIA. We will never forget you guys. The sacrifices made by our men and women are un-repayable. We owe each and every one of them a huge debt of grattitude for the freedom's and priviledges which they shed their blood for. We love you guys.

Thanks

Posted by: dave at May 28, 2006 11:16 PM